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          The same air of a person who has endured much, yet has a sense of naivety. More than anything else there is a feeling that she is not quite of this world.
I am inside the Jackson house. The décor is chintzy faux Versailles with moments of 1970s browns and oranges. There are paintings of princesses, lots of sculptures of giant hands, galloping horses and the odd giraffe. There is a Lladro style ornament depicting Michael Jackson holding up the world with doves and children. It’s ornate and sentimental, a bit like Michael.
I walk out past a row of children’s bikes - a reminder that she now has custody of her three grandchildren - and a swimming pool, in view of majestic mountains and the California blue sky to get to Katherine Jackson’s quarters. I had to go through double-gated security to get to this house 45 minutes from Hollywood.
She greets me warily but sweetly. She’s dressed in a pale blue jacket and black slacks. Her skin looks much younger than her 81 years. Her eyes are dark and dart around. She seems to be frisking me for my soul. The Jacksons are naturally suspicious and they all believe in various conspiracy theories surrounding the death of her son and their brother. More of that later.
She has just come off the phone from her son Jermaine who has been all over the news vehemently opposed to the Michael Forever – The Tribute Concert that is happening at the Millennium Stadium, Cardiff. It will be a global tribute to Jackson that will be televised and downloaded to more countries than any other show in the history of pop (so they claim). Cardiff was chosen because they needed a big stadium with a roof.
JLS will perform with Marlon, Tito and Jackie Jackson. And Beyoncé will wear a Michael wig and dance, introduced by the Jackson children – Prince Michael, 14, Paris, 13, and Blanket (passport name Prince Michael II), 10.
The concert is one more thing that has caused friction within the family because Jermaine decreed it was inappropriate to stage the concert at the same time as Dr Conrad Murray goes on trial for the involuntary manslaughter of Michael Jackson.
Katherine Jackson seems keen to diminish the spectre of the sad Michael Jackson plagued with demons and eccentricities and get on with celebrating his memory and cherishing his talent.
What does she feel about Jermaine speaking out so forcefully against the concert? Has this divided the family?
‘I don’t understand why my son feels that way,’ says Katherine in the soft, whispery voice that makes me have to lean in very close to hear her.
‘Jermaine feels it’s not the right time because of the trial coming up. Michael’s been gone two years now. They kept postponing the trial. We didn’t know when exactly it was coming around and I don’t see anything wrong. This is nothing to do with it. He has his own thoughts. I just got off the phone talking about it with him a few minutes ago.’
Was she able to bring him round? ‘No. He still feels that way. He has his own mind. He’s entitled to his opinion.’
Are all the other siblings behind it? ‘Yes. Three of them are performing and my daughter La Toya will be there. But just because some of the family don’t feel the same it doesn’t mean the family is divided.’
The family divided is a well-trodden path that Katherine Jackson is weary of. I have heard from several sources that Jermaine seems to be acting out the role of the new Joe Jackson, their disciplinarian father who used to beat them if they didn’t work hard enough in rehearsals. Sources say that it is usually Jermaine and Randy on one side and Jackie, Tito, Marlon and La Toya on another, and Janet one step removed. Katherine disputes this.
‘When we all get together we get on well. I don’t know how this started but it got all over the world that we don’t get along. That’s the biggest lie that’s ever been told. I’m so tired of people believing things like that. Every family has their problems. It doesn’t mean we never get along. Every person is their own individual person. They can agree on something today and tomorrow they might change their mind, but they might be strong enough to just hold on. That’s the way it is.’
Are you saying that if you don’t agree with somebody it doesn’t mean you don’t love them? ‘Thank you. That’s exactly what I’m saying.’
‘My kids are grown now. I always tell them this is your brother, this is your family. If you don’t agree with them and something happened to them you would not pass your family by. You would always give a helping hand. That’s family. They may fight and have their differences and I’m not saying this is about my family, but this is family period. They may not speak for a while – and this never happened in my family – but if somebody got sick or needed a helping hand I would always be there. Family is always there. You may not agree with everything people in your family are saying. You can’t change a person but that doesn’t mean you don’t love them.’


She becomes a little less afraid. But you sense in her a woman that has endured pain, betrayal, loss. You feel that she might be frail and snap at any minute. Yet at the same time she has endured and will continue. Those around her say that she is indeed the driving force of the family and that nothing happens if she doesn’t want it to.
She is the guardian of Michael’s children. He wanted that. You can’t help wondering if she has the stamina to bring up two teenagers and a ten-year-old. I’m impressed she knows who JLS are, but isn’t it all very demanding? ‘No, not at all. I have a lot of people helping. They’re good kids and I don’t have that much to worry about.’
What sort of things do they like doing? ‘They have their friends over. They ride their bikes.’ It’s almost more strange that she makes them seem normal. Their upbringing even before the tragedy was at the very least eccentric. Remember they went out dressed in Spider Man masks and Prince in a surgical mask. Yet they sound very well adjusted.
‘They go to acting school and they love that, although Paris doesn’t need lessons,’ Katherine chuckles, meaning she is a natural actress.
What makes Katherine happy now? ‘That’s not an easy question. I believe in the resurrection and I’m happy when Paris and Prince come home from school happy. Prince is a very good student. He’s always saying ‘Grandma I got a 98 in my test. It makes me happy to see them smile.’
Does she see Michael in them? ‘Yes, I do,’ she says sounding distinct and sombre. ‘They are all going to be like him, especially Paris. She has pictures of him hanging all over her wall. When I had a decorator come in who moved them she brought them all out. “I want daddy hanging on the walls”. I don’t know how she could do it but she does.
‘She took a pillow and one of his jackets. She said, “I don’t want a jacket that’s been cleaned. I want a jacket with his scent on it”. She put the jacket over the pillow and she breathes it. It’s still there. That’s how she is. She said, “I don’t ever want it cleaned. He’s worn it and it smells of him and I don’t ever want the smell to go away”.’ More weeping.
‘They’re doing OK. It’s been OK,’ she says nodding solemnly. ‘I’m doing OK. It’s hard being a mother and losing your child. It’s the hardest thing. It shouldn’t be that way round. There’s not a day goes by that I don’t…’ her whispers turn into tears.
‘People tell me all the time that I’m strong, but I don’t think so. Paris, Prince and Blanket they do suffer in different ways. Prince tried to be stronger than the others. He wants to be a man. He doesn’t want people to see what’s inside. During the funeral when the kids were handed the crown and they put it on top of the casket,’ she cries again. ‘He just put his hand on my shoulder and started to cry. He wanted to be strong because he was around all his cousins. From the moment they came from the hospital they were all having a fit… they were all bawling their eyes out.’
She composes herself slightly. ‘He was a very good son. There was so much misunderstanding about him because the world tried to poison people against him. All this molestation stuff was just a lie, Oprah Winfrey says if a child tells you something, believe it. It’s just the opposite! That first boy came out and admitted it. When it first happened it was all over the world. Then when he admitted he lied because the father made him and the father wanted the money it was so small nobody read it.’
She is still outraged about this. But the outrage is overwhelmed by her sense of loss. She recalls in detail what happened the day she got the news that something was wrong with Michael.
‘I got a call to come to the hospital. They said Michael’s in the hospital. We rushed down there and when we got there we said where is he and they took me to another room. They wanted to sit down and talk to me, and that’s when I was told. I said ‘How is he?’ They told me he didn’t make it. But all I could say was ‘How is he?’ I think when your child has died there is nothing to take that pain away. But the concert can make me feel good that people all over the world can love him even after his death. He’s been given awards after his death and it made me feel good to know that all that bad press perhaps people didn’t believe it after all. I know he didn’t do it. People say things. They are mixed up. They don’t know. These people who did it they know who they are. They know what they did.’ She’s resolutely silent and not going to tell me who the people are.
She seems to be saying that there was a conspiracy to murder her son, and in this thinking the family are not at war. Jermaine in his book You Are Not Alone: Michael Through A Brother’s Eyes is very graphic revealing details such as Michael’s chimp wore clothes and Poison perfume by Christian Dior. The book paints him in all his weirdness, but it exonerates him from any crime. The family all do toe one united line, which is that dark forces claimed Michael. Not those within him, but something or someone beyond his reach. Even this fractured and broken family can agree Michael was a victim although nobody is sure exactly of what.
La Toya Jackson has spent the last two years making a documentary and it is alleged that in it she will reveal who exactly she thinks is responsible for his alleged murder.
Did Michael ever talk about if anything happened to him how he wanted her to look after the children? ‘No. He never talked about that but he always felt that someone was after him, trying to kill him. He always felt that. Lisa Marie said that she told that to him when she was married to him. That they were trying to put him in jail for something he hadn’t done to get him out of the way. He would say to me “Why are they after me? I haven’t done anything. What are they accusing me of?”’
It sounds like he was in a panic. I don’t want to say it sounds like he was paranoid in front of her in case I make her cry again. ‘No,’ she says, very resolute. ‘I don’t think he was panicking. He would say it just like that if he were here with us today. He felt something was going to happen. He was closer to people. He had meetings with them and he knew their personalities, but I can’t say any more.’
Katherine has already seen the film of Beyoncé’s performance, which had to be worked out in advance because she couldn’t perform the routine with the increasing baby bump. I heard that she was dressed as Michael. ‘She wears a Michael wig. She’s not dressed like Michael, so she doesn’t look like him. But she sang one of his songs and spent 12 hours recording it because she wanted to express how much she loved him.’ The first of many bouts of tears.
‘Every time I think that people did care about my son…,’ more weeping, She can’t finish the sentence. What is she hoping that the global concert will bring to people? ‘I treasure this tribute knowing that these people wouldn’t be volunteering if they didn’t care about my son. I think JLS were inspired by him. It makes me feel really good that these people are coming together. If he were alive he’d be proud to see that a lot of people were giving back. He loved people, especially children. It is so emotional because he really loved everyone and he’s not here to see it. I’m sure he’ll be nearby.’
Does she think that she can feel him around her and communicate with him and his spirit? She shakes her head. ‘Michael is sleeping now and I know he’s not conscious of anything.’ She says this as a measure of ultimate sadness and relief.
Katherine Jackson says that her favourite Michael Jackson song was Man In The Mirror and she is looking forward to it being performed at the global tribute concert which she is attending. She doesn’t like to fly. Outside her house there is a giant brown and orange trailer in the driveway. It looks like a tour bus. She and the children recently did a long road trip in it. She likes the trailer.
Will the profits from the concert go to Michael’s children? ‘No. Michael’s favourite charities. Mostly he liked giving to children. Wherever he was he would visit orphans and hospitals and babies and children in need. He would always give. Since he was that high.’ She gestures to knee level. ‘He would look at the kids on TV. The African kids with big bellies and flies all over them and he would cry and he would say I’m going to help them one day. He would always say that.’
I had heard that the concert was to directly benefit Michael’s children because the Michael Jackson estate had planned to hold on to the millions in trust till the children were 40. Although when Jackson died there were substantial debts, the subsequent posthumous sales of albums and DVDs are said to have generated £196 million.
On the day we meet there is a news story that suggested the trust had revised their policy and were to give $30 million to Katherine and the children and to some charities.
‘I don’t know where you’ve heard that.’ It was all over the papers, television and Internet. ‘The only thing I’m going to say is they are unfair.’ Perhaps she means the estate is unfair because it’s a trust and the children will not be awarded that money straight away. Allegedly the trustees do better out of managing a trust the larger the sum of money in it.
She continues, ‘A lot of lies came out this morning. They say they’re selling Hayvenhurst (the Michael Jackson estate that he grew up in). That’s not true. I haven’t agreed to that. I don’t want it sold and they’re not selling it. It’s being remodelled.’ Will she go back there? ‘No, I’m staying here. I like it. It’s very light and pleasant here. The other house I lived in for 40 years. Michael grew up in it since he was 11.’
Does she have too many memories? ‘I like this one because it’s lighter, brighter. Hayvenhurst is an English Tudor. Michael remodelled it as a gift to me. I love it and I don’t want to get rid of it.’ Does it hold happy memories? ‘Yes it does. The most happy time for me and my family was when everybody was at home, nobody was married, my kids were young and they could go out and play and come back and be excited to tell me what happened. That was before they were signed to any record companies. They were just in talent shows. And we were all there sitting around the table eating and talking and having fun.
‘I used to cook mostly soul food. In the wintertime we would buy a quarter of a beef and put it in the freezer and I would freeze peaches so we would have steaks and gravy and rice and peach cobbler. We would always have a dessert. Maybe fried apple turnovers. I don’t make those now. Those were my happy days. But they will come again.
‘I am a spiritual person and I feel I will see my son again at the resurrection.’ What else used to make you unhappy, before this devastation? ‘I can’t think of anything. I try to be strong.’
It certainly must have taken strength to stay with her husband of over 60 years, Joe Jackson. Her children have spoken about their father’s brutality. Michael in particular felt tortured by it. He lost his childhood and became a perpetual child. His mother watched all this.
This is not a woman without intelligence and drive. but it’s hard to grasp how this all feeling empathic matriarch stood by as her husband Joe regularly beat his children if they didn’t get their songs right in rehearsal.
There are also rumours that Joe Jackson cheated on his wife. Does she still love him? ‘Well yes, I do. That’s a strange question.’ Not really. I want to say to her not many women would. But instead I ask does she get on with him? ‘Oh yes.’
Here I see parallels with Michael, to want to believe the good in people, that the world can be beautiful when it most definitely isn’t. Does that make her naïve or strong?
‘I’ve kept things, but I don’t have his pictures out all the time. I’m never going to forget him. Every time I see something of his it just makes me feel bad.’
His stage clothes were auctioned but his personal clothes were not. ‘I’ve just got some little things of Michael’s.’ She shakes her head as if she is both cherishing and tortured by the memories.

* Artists performing live at the Michael Forever - The Tribute Concert at the Millennium Stadium, Cardiff on October 8 include Leona Lewis, Christina Aguilera, Cee Lo Green, Smokey Robinson, Pixie Lott. For tickets go to michaelforevertribute.com.